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Scifi and Fantasy Forum: Sci-Fi and Fantasy General Discussions: How to make Armor and how to forge Weapons
How to make Armor and how to forge Weapons
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Quote:If you have read K.J. Parker's Fencer Trilogy, the main character creates a bow that is made from human parts (sinews, blood etc etc) which was very good. Is such a thing really possible? Or did he make it up. Haha! Try to answer this. ;p
- Windborn
I got to admit it, I’ve never heard of someone making a bow out of human body parts…. Ughhhhh, but throughout history people have made bows out of animal parts such as whale bone. But they are hard to work with, and wood supposedly works better. Human bone is out of the question; the reason is because of the shape and the location of the marrow. (I had to e-mail someone to find this out) Making a bone out of bone requires slicing one side, and a bit of lamination. As for the bowstring, historically the best ones where made out of sinew so, as disgusting as it sounds, I suppose you could make a bowstring out of human flesh. Although most people, (Most sane people anyway) would use the tendon of an elk, or deer rather than one of a person. You can also make bowstrings out of hide too, but I don’t know much about that.
Your question is very hard to answer, I never read up on how to make bows out of anything but wood. If you want to know how to make one out of wood, I could explain it you if you want, but I would recommend making a crossbow instead. It’s more fun.
Since once again, no one has asked a question for a while, I’ll pitch in another little piece of advice.
How to make better leather armor
Most people who make leather armor, use wax to harden it from blows, but although this might be good for LARP or SCA combat, it isn’t the very best way to make leather armor. Wax hardening is actually very good for warding off blunt weapons, but you take a sword to it, and the leather will peel like slices of butter. An arrow would treat such armor like tissue paper. The technique I will describe here is easy to do at home.
Materials: (do this all in your kitchen)
- Veggie-Tanned Leather- Easy to find (Ask around)
- A cooking pot big enough to hold your leather
- Cutting Board
- Water
- Ruler
- Hacksaw
Directions:
1. Soak the leather briefly in hot water
2. Fill the pot with warm water and heat to about 180 degrees
3. Add the leather and wait for it to go dark and begin to curl up, it will now be rather strechy
4. Take the leather pices and cut them into needed shapes on your cutting board with the hacksaw (a small cutting board recommended)
5. The boiling will shrink the leather an make it harder, thus making it stronger, the longer you let it boil the harder and more brittle it will dry, its up to you how long to leave it in, but I tried this technique with a few pieces of an old briefcase and it seemed to get the best texture when I left in boil for a little over a minute.
You MUST take into account the shrinkage! The average shrinkage rate is usally about 7/8 to an inch if you leave it in for 1-1 ½ min.
If I have time later, I’ll post a bit on how to make a helmet out of leather, 
Posted By:  Adam Apr 05, 2004 - 09:35 pm |       | ••••. That's some nice stuff. Thanks very much!
theres a website around somewhere that sells swords and stuff, if my memory serves, which it usually does, well sometimes
http://www.battleorders.co.uk/
quite interesting...
How to make Riveted Chain Mail
(Without a Forge)
you might be wondering why I’m posting another topic on chain mail. This one is different. It tells you how to make really cool riveted chain mail. Riveted mail, is actually more historically correct (and stronger) than most plain chain mail you can make today. I just recently tried it and found out how easy I can do it without a forge. I used to anneal (a process of softening metal) my rings in the small forge at my friend’s farm. Then I would take a hammer, with one accurate strike, flatten them, and punch a tiny rivet hole through each end. If you do it this way, and put the rivets in at a forge, it does take time. It is almost as easy as the method I will explain below except for one little thing.
Not everyone has a forge.
Warning! Do NOT heat galvanized metal in your grill unless you want to die choking on toxic fumes! Galvanized metal has zinc in it! If you heat zinc, you produce very deadly gas. THIS IS TREMENDOUSLY IMPORTANT!
Directions
- Your remember how I taught you how to make links right? So now throw all those links into your backyard grill and let them simmer overnight (I’m not kidding!)
- Take a regular hammer once you annealed them, (that’s what you did with the grill) they should be workably soft enough to pound them flat.
- Take a pair of pliers and close the rings so that the ends overlap each other well.
- Use the smallest drill bit you have and put a hole through the overlapped ends.
- Get a box of 5/8 nails, (can be found at such stores as Home Depot or K-Mart) and dump a bunch into an expendable metal cooking ladle.
- Heat the ladle with the nails using a propane torch for about 1-5 mins until they are soft, or as I call it, annealed.
- Once they are soft enough, hammer them through the hole you made with the drill and don’t burn yourself! *Gloves are a nice idea for this part
- Trim the nail once it is fully down in your hole, leave a length of about the head of a dime, or 1mm so you can pound the other side of your homemade rivet flat and make the other head.
- Your done! You’ve made a riveted link…
There is one problem though… your links look like **** (edited so Bmat doesn’t bother me) , there is a much better way, that produces more realistic-looking and better made links… that is if you have some time and a forge. (not to mention a bunch of non-standard tools.)
The link bellow tells you how to do just that, with an old stove, an anvil, and proper riveting tools. Riveting for dummies
What would you guys want me to post on? I haven't got a single question in a long time... 
| Posted By: Boikat Jun 02, 2004 - 06:49 am | | Hi Battlepaw!
I guess a simple question would be what is the simplest way to shape sheet metal?
I came up with a design for a suit of armor that I "prototyped" out of poasterboard, which came out fairly good, and want to redo, at least the helmet, in sheet metal (aluminum). Needless to say it's not "authentic" olde style armor, but it has a touch of that, and a touch of "scifi" thrown in, in that the helmet is "segmented" so that it can fold almost all the way back, being made of overlapping sheets. The prototype was able to do this, after a fasion, but carboard is a bit too flimsy, so I ended up just taping it so that the indificual segments would not flop around, whereas on the metal version, i should be able to come up with a "locking tab" arrangement.
The question is, what is the best way to shape the overlapping segments of the helmet. I would imagine it would be similar to the way multi segmented shoulder or knee guards are made (if they were made to actually articulate the way I imagine)?
Quote:Hi Battlepaw!
I guess a simple question would be what is the simplest way to shape sheet metal?
I came up with a design for a suit of armor that I "prototyped" out of poasterboard, which came out fairly good, and want to redo, at least the helmet, in sheet metal (aluminum). Needless to say it's not "authentic" olde style armor, but it has a touch of that, and a touch of "scifi" thrown in, in that the helmet is "segmented" so that it can fold almost all the way back, being made of overlapping sheets. The prototype was able to do this, after a fasion, but carboard is a bit too flimsy, so I ended up just taping it so that the indificual segments would not flop around, whereas on the metal version, i should be able to come up with a "locking tab" arrangement.
The question is, what is the best way to shape the overlapping segments of the helmet. I would imagine it would be similar to the way multi segmented shoulder or knee guards are made (if they were made to actually articulate the way I imagine)?
Boikat
There are two real answers to this question... The first is with rivets and hinges, and they are really easy to make if you have time... look above to my annealing process post and notice I use simple nails and a torch to make rivets. I've had some experience making armor recently... out of an old stop sign... (I obviously spray painted the stop sign another color...) I found the idea somewhere online and the stop sign at a local junk yard underneath some other discards. The simple and most effective way to make good, usable armor is with heat and a hammer and lots of time on your hands. For the Heat, I used my little portable forge, and got frustrated with how long it took to make the stop sign soft enough to hammer without breaking. You need only to get the metal to a reddish-orange color... do not keep in too long! You will have problems with the armor being too soft... aluminum seems to have the tendency to be useless as for anything if you anneal it too much. Bring it up to a red-orange color and shape it then quickly cool it! If you haven't done this before it seems really hard... but it really isn't if you do it a few times. This seems like alot of work yes, and it is. But making armor that doesn’t look like sheet metal discards out of sheet metal discards can be tricky. If you armor looks too unauthentic... paint it! do a black base paint and put clear gloss over it like polish.. I've seen someone make wonders with this idea. But he is also a good artist and got the texture just right.
If you are a beginner, my advice is to NOT start off with a helmet, start with a breastplate. Not a cuirass (I made the mistake of thinking a cuirass was easy to make) It lets you get the hang of shaping metal with heat. And is almost impossible to completely mess up. I could elaborate more on this, but would need a whole new post and time to make digtal pictures of the process.
The other way to do it, is with latex. Now you might be frowning at this idea, but it is really fun, and most LARP groups will let you wear it. Latex can really work wonders if you are making a complicated set of armor. Latex is more expensive, but is so so so much nicer. If you really want to use this way, I can make a post for you on it, but I need you to let me know here, because it would take a bit of time to explain (and I need to put links to sites and pictures on the post I don’t have on this computer)
As for the overlapping segments, I’ve never done a helmet like that yet, but the only way I could imagine it done is with rivets and simple hinges. E-mail me at battlepaw@yahoo.com if you really want help with this part. I have the idea on how to do in in my mind but have to check something first.
A good example of leather segmenting
Go here if you have any other questions on how to shape metal with a forge.
| Posted By: Aldan Jun 02, 2004 - 10:05 am | | Aluminum can be quite difficult to shape, since it is a much more brittle metal, and reheating it multiple times to avoid shattering it can be quite damaging to the metal, unlike with steel/iron. One reason that it is more expensive to buy an aluminum part for an automobile, rather than a steel one, is because the shaping process is more involved.
Some things to keep in mind...
Oh, and if any of my info is incorrect, please let me know...
Yes... I should have mentioned that... you only heat aluminum once! but, do it right the first time! Aldan is right... my alum chain mail links and armor scraps shatter constantly if you don't heat it at least once. Also it is possible to crack the metal if you don't heat it up first. If you don't have a forge you can use a tourch to heat the part of the metal you are shapeing, but only bring it to a red-orange glow, and shape, then douse the whole thing in water. If you let it sit too long hot, It becomes too soft.
I've been doing work for a friend this summer, I'm helping him make a full suit of plate armor.... Its not going too well... But I'm learning loads. I'll be putting pictures of my progress on my website if anyone wants to check it out.
Anyone have a question on armor or weapontry? I'm all ears...
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